Flycatcher ID please and monthly challenge

[oldfulica]

We got another flycatcher today on the Popkum Trail. This is the boardwalk trail on the road towards Cheam Wetlands . I think with the shorter primaries that it is a Dusky. Am I right?





This trail quite active today with Yellow Warblers, Wilsons Warblers Black-headed Grosbeaks, 5 Band-tailed pigeons and FOY Cedar Waxwing.

[paulos]

This looks pretty good for a Dusky to me.

[oldfulica]

May 17, 2022 20:28:26 GMT -8 paulos said:

This looks pretty good for a Dusky to me.

Thanks for the help Paulos. I was hoping it would vocalize but no luck there.

[Jon]

I'll cast a vote to Hammond's.

Why?

P1, 2 and 3 have a large gap before the rest of the primaries. Maybe it's just coincidence, but Sibley's seems to show that for Hammond's whereas dusky is more well-spaced.

It appears to have a bit of a "vest"

Notch in tail isn't a good ID feature, but some dusky won't have that.

Bill doesn't look very fat to me.

Head is peaked (also not a good feature, but...)


I hope others will weigh in to tell me I'm wrong (and why) 👍


I do think the length of the primaries as seen from the 2nd photo is more conducive for Dusky, but it is a tough angle with some obscuring branches.

[Krissi]

I agree with Hammond’s. The “vest” is too pronounced, and the yellow wash is a bit too yellow for Dusky. I could be wrong, as I’m still just getting into the subtle differences between these two species.

[oldfulica]

May 17, 2022 17:01:11 GMT -8 oldfulica said:

We got another flycatcher today on the Popkum Trail. This is the boardwalk trail on the road towards Cheam Wetlands . I think with the shorter primaries that it is a Dusky. Am I right?


This trail quite active today with Yellow Warblers, Wilsons Warblers Black-headed Grosbeaks, 5 Band-tailed pigeons and FOY Cedar Waxwing.

Thanks for all your inputs on this gals and guys. The reason I thought Dusky was the length of primaries which don't reach to the end of the undertail coverts. The picture I submitted earlier and which Gord confirmed as a Hammonds, had primaries well beyond the undertail coverts. Perhaps posture may affect this feature but both birds had similar stances. Thanks again and if anyone else wants to comment feel free. On another note I have just seen a picture of a California Scrubjay taken yesterday here in Abbotsford. It was in a private backyard. The owner has given me permission to check it out. We tried this morning but missed it by 15 minutes. She doesn't want me to publicise the location.

[paulos]

Good discussion! I was a little nervous putting my opinion out initially because of the bill in particular; I would tend toward Hammond's based on bill alone, but I have seen some variation. I do agree with Len that the primary extension is relatively short (wing tips don't reach the undertail coverts). I have also observed Dusky Flycatchers with a peak on the crown, though I do agree is normally more of a Hammond's feature. In terms of the plumage and vest, I don't find that very reliable. Many Dusky Flycatchers can look bright and contrasting, depending on age and individual variation. I had not paid attention to the specific primaries like Jon pointed out, so I will have to look at that more. It appears that photos of Dusky Flycatchers show the primaries much more evenly spaced and close together (I can't find any with the pattern of this bird). So maybe the apparent short wing/long tail look is an angle issue on this bird, or we may have an unusual bird.

So pro-Hammond's:
-Bill size/shape
-Spacing of primaries

Very slightly pro-Hammond's:
-Head peak

Pro-Dusky
-Short primaries not reaching end of undertail coverts (creating long-tailed look)